Want design feedback for your new game? Then you’ve found the right thread! Post here to get precious player feedback. Discuss until next Friday, when we’ll lock the old and start anew.
How To Ask For Feedback?
Show - Pics, videos, or best of all, a playable game!
Be Concise - Who’s got time for Wall 'O Text? Less is more
How To Give Feedback?
Be Positive - Finding redeeming qualities in the worst of games, is in itself a game
Focus On The Design - Not the designer
Be Specific - “Your game sucks!” is for nubs
What To Show?
Minimally Viable Product (MVP) - Core game play >>> everything else
I was late last week, so I’m reposting for additional feedback.
My turn? In March, I posted the Minimally Viable Product (MVP) version of Block 64. After that, I took a break, to spend time with my family, healing. Until a month had passed. That’s when looking more closely at my analytics, I began to realize that people enjoyed my tiny, 16 day bullet. The retention rates were approaching 20% (the industry standard for a good game)! So, over time, I began to slowly improve it. I added ‘Zap’, at my wife’s request. I added upgrades, diamonds, and skins. Finally, when the coding was all done, I sought an artist over on Unity’s Job forum. That’s where I found Peter Simon.
I upgraded my tiny bullet into a small canon-ball. And if you have an Android device, I’d love your feedback.
Your game is interesting. I like the idea of it, but man, it is way too hard! I think I tried about 20 times, with typical game length of 5-10 seconds, and a high score of 2.
Of course it could be that some people like games that hard. As someone pointed out last week, Flappy Bird did OK with that. But personally, if I downloaded this, I’d probably have given it only about 5 attempts before deleting it in disgust. (And, BTW, it took me 4 games to even figure out what was edible and what was going to kill me.)
However, the game is cute and I think this is fixable! Start with no enemies, and a handful of shrimp. After the player has eaten a shrimp, introduce an enemy. This gives them time to understand the mechanic before the giant GAME OVER screen smacks them in the face, and also teaches them what to eat.
Also, merely surviving and eating shrimp isn’t hugely satisfying (though again, it’s no less so than flappy bird). I was hoping that by eating shrimp, I would get bigger, and thus be able to eat some more of the enemies (there are some smaller ones that I thought I could take on). If you do this, be sure to clearly indicate which ones are safe, and which ones will kill you.
Finally, you asked for feedback on the colors. I’m afraid I didn’t understand this. What colors? I tried the “Colors” option but it seems to just bring up a box that says “Choose Colors” and “Random”, but neither one has any effect that I could see.
If it’s just a matter of changing the colors of the sprites, I wouldn’t bother — that seems incidental to the gameplay to me.
Really interesting mechanic, and I think you’re heading in a neat direction… please keep refining!
Hi all! I’m looking for some design feedback of my new game Apocalypse City: Last Stand! Just click the banner above to go directly to the website where you can play a WebGL version of the game.
Note: If the game does not load, please let me know. In the meantime for anyone who encounters a WebGL loading issue, you can try our Webplayer version here: http://apocalypsecity.net/webplayer.html
Thanks in advance for your time and feedback.
P.S. the game is best played and experienced with a friend since it’s multiplayer.
About Game: Apocalypse City: Last Stand is a casual survival game that includes deathmatch style gameplay with survival elements. Engage in untimed free-for-all matches while exploring post-apocalyptic environments trying to survive mutated creatures and rogue survivors. Search for loot such as armor, medkits, and extra ammo to gun down your enemies. Hunt mutated creatures, battle for top ranking survivor status, or make a friend and try to survive together!
About a month ago I decided to do a little experiment applying more AI and interaction to a shmup. My theory was that doing this would make for a bit more interesting and engaging game than the standard bullet hell games we see today.
I took several days completely off from development just to recharge my battery and clear my mind. Then starting a few days ago through tonight I put 10 hours in on so am now at 42 hours on this project… Simple Scrolling Shooter: So… this is my latest update on this experiment of more interaction and better AI.
So… What’s New This Time?
First, I finished off my “to do” list to get the game up to the normal stuff found in shmups. This meant adding a stat line at the top showing Score, Armor and Shield ratings. And making it so the player can be destroyed now. The new Unity GUI stuff made the stat bar very easy & quick to knock out.
I also added two power-ups. One increases your Shield and the other increases your Armor.
Then I added two enemies. One is the original enemy from the very first version. I figured I had it all implemented might as well stick it back in. The other is a truly new enemy. It has a more complex movement pattern than the other enemies and a more obvious reaction to being hit. Hopefully, this enemy will help make things a bit more interesting despite the very simple appearance.
Added support for PS3 / PC (and other) controllers. I purchased InControl on the asset store and that saved me a lot of time on this part.
I removed the speech because it seemed more distracting than anything else.
Finally, I just kind of play tested and fine-tuned things a bit here and there.
The Screenshots
Here, the player has completely lost their shield. Fortunately, a Shield Increase powerup is right over there!
Play well and you will eventually reach the end of the waves. And might just do it with full armor and full shields.
Other Stuff
This was just a little experiment and I am not sure how much further I will take it now. I guess it all depends on feedback. At some point I need to get back to my main project and get that game done. I must admit though it has been fun developing this game and I kind of want to do the boss battle.
Your Feedback
Compared to other shmups you have played does it seem more engaging?
Was your game experience a little more Interesting?
Did you feel (notice) any difference in behavior with these enemies compared to enemies in other shmups?
Controls
This is all explained on the How to Play screen. However, you can probably use a controller as well. I added support but cannot guaranteed that all of them will work. Just try it and see. D-Pad or left stick moves and of course the action buttons fire your weapons and use the ray.
At first I tried the WebGL version. Waited 1 minute and 19 seconds then it stopped with an InvalidStateError. The progress bar showed it was about 45% complete.
In contrast the Unity Webplayer version fully loaded in 30 seconds. If this is what WebGL is bringing to the future of web games it is really going to suck with load times increasing by 6 times.
Anyway… first let me say I am not into FPS very much. At least not the modern style so I went into this thinking I’d probably hate it but also give it a fair chance.
What I liked
The control of the game was very good. I especially appreciated the auto-jumping. It reminds me of a time when devs were not afraid of taking on a bit of extra work in the interest of creating a better game play experience.
The atmosphere was also very good. The colors, lighting and ambient soundtrack are very well done.
The pace of the game is excellent.
What I think can be improved
A bit more feedback. At one point I had dropped a mutant and after I walked past it just happened to turn around (I basically went from building to building checking all around before and after) in time to see it stand back up and come running toward me. I tried to fire but was unable to despite having ammo (had just found a couple of ammo clips). No idea why I could not fire. Maybe I was reloading?
Perhaps some gear (armor) or simply more health to make the player a little tougher. Once the mutant was on top of me I was dead quite quickly.
Summary
Overall, I think you have done an excellent job on this. Like I said, I do not normally get into modern FPS games and yet I liked this one. Trust me that is really saying something about the game. Of course, it could also mean that all of the people who love modern FPS games may not like this one.
I dont remember how i solved it before but theres a way to make the webgl load faster (one of the build options).
I replayed the SHMUP again and this time it was alot more fun (now that you actually have the health/shield and powerup mechanics). I guess maybe a restart button because I kept dying
Thank you so much for taking the time to play my game and provide some feedback! Much appreciate!
I’ll keep the ammo/shoot bug you experienced in mind, as currently I haven’t been able to reproduce it. I definitely plan to spend more time on balancing the gameplay, tweaking health, applied damage etc.
I took a moment to check out your game as well! Unfortunately I don’t recall the last time I ever played a Shmup Game to compare your game to. So it’s hard for me to say if there are any bugs, or what could be improved. Overall I really liked the originally behind the vegetable theme of the game, it’s pretty funny! Gameplay is pretty smooth, AI is good, background is nice, overall I think it’s a very entertaining shmup. Good job!
@jonkuze - I played the WebGL version in Chrome 43.0.2357.124m on Windows 7 64-bit, and it loaded just fine. It’s impressive that you got a multiplayer shooter working smoothly in WebGL. The player controls are very polished. I’d prefer a deeper zoom with the RMB, and more feedback when the PC is hit such as more reaction animations and sounds. The ambient sound is perfect – eerie without being distracting. Can you add more light and shadow contrast in the level? I also noticed some camera clipping, especially if you walk up to a building and turn 180 degrees so the player’s back is to the wall. All in all, a nice game! I’m going to have to grab my friends and play a few rounds
@GarBenjamin - I don’t play a lot of shmups, but this one catches my interest because of the AI. (And the quirky vegetable theme. :-)) It feels more challenging than other shmups because you can’t fall into rote patterns. If you continue working on it, I’d really like to see AI director-style scaling, more feedback from enemy units that let you know what they’re thinking, and more group coordination.
Thanks for taking the time to check it out (again) and give your feedback!
LOL! Seems like the choice to use veggies was a good one. I’ve made many shmups over the years and always they had space ships. Having done that and played shmups so many times I was kind of burnt out on space ships or airplanes so decided to do something different and just be silly. That way I didn’t think about graphics and could focus on the more important stuff.
Glad you liked the experiment. It has been a good bit of fun to work on. I might make a test enemy squadron that works together. Group level AI instead of individual entity AI could be fun to do.
Thanks TonyLi! There is definitely alot more I want to add to it and improve. Glad you enjoyed it! I’m looking forward to keeping polishing it, and adding more features without hopefully without too much of a performance cost. WebGL is a real pain! But totally worth it.
Okay I played it by myself for a few minutes because no one was online. Seemed to work alright no problems with that even on the openGL version. I really enjoyed the look of it. I was impressed with the AI, I jumped over the fence thinking he wouldnt be able to get me, but he also jumped – so thats a plus. Killed a few of the monsters, didnt die to them, just ran around until i found more ammo and eventually i just got a bit bored so I camped on top of the rotated building waiting for another monster to show up but he didnt.
But in terms of actual gameplay at least as a single player it seems to be lacking (at least for now)
@GarBenjamin - Tried out your new version. Here’s my thoughts:
What Went Well
The vegetable style is cute - not sure how to spin it, though I like it. SO many foods to leverage. Quickly gives ideas for boss-mobs
The gameplay is like defender, and I liked defender! There’s a lot you can work with here.
Controls - the controls felt pretty good. I liked the responsiveness of the enemies - figuring out the patterns was fun.
It’s already pretty fun - a good solid prototype of a basic side-scrolling SHMUP.
And It Could Be Even Stronger
Can you remove the ‘key-trigger’ to save the people? Ideally, I just want that to automatically happen once I’m close enough (over them). Then, I’d like it to take ~1.5 seconds, to pick them up, making the picking up of people a minor stress point. Finally, I feel weird with them flying off to space, I kind of want them to be rescued into the ship (who cares if they fit).
Style - pixel/8-bit. It’s too early to discuss art. And, at the same time, I wanted to observe that a game about food, fruits, and vegetables cries out for vector art. Maybe flat, maybe bubbly, maybe cutesy cartoon. While 8-bit is fun, it feels wrong here. The same holds for the audio - I want to here boops and pops, and bounces, as opposed to scratchy, dry, 1980s death sounds.
Armor - the feedback on armor could be stronger - I like how sometimes it shows up in front. You could use that around you, to indicate how strong your shield is - above, below, in front, around, something. The bar at top is very far away and I never really noticed it was changing. Also, I’m not clear why I have a ‘Shield’ and ‘Armor’ - I recommend picking one or the other, unless the shield is a temporary upgrade, in which case, that was not clear.
Score - if you earn score, it’s not clear. One thing you can do is spawn points that fly up to the score bar, and then quick-pulse the score when they arrive. Alternately, killing monsters can drop coins/points that you fly near - this is an added element of mini-stress (ooh, don’t want to miss that - which is a player-driven-task), plus it allows opportunities for upgrades.
Upgrades - I only saw one - the three-way. I liked it. Maybe upgrades can time out - like 10 seconds, or certain number of shots. This again offers an opportunity for upgrades and for player-driven-tasks (holding the missiles till the boss).
Weapons - Alternately, you could have a weapon that fires all the time, plus a triggered weapon. The all-the-time could be weak, and again, upgradeable.
Bosses - Yes, you’re going to need waves and bosses with this game. Like most SHMUPS, and you probably know this.
Thanks for taking the time to have another play and provide feedback. I appreciate it.
It’s been just an experiment for the AI / interaction more than a game. Mainly I just wanted to make something that showed what I am talking about when I ramble about interaction and AI in games. Thought if I took a genre that has about the least of these things I could add just a little and it would be easy to see how important they are to making a game fun or at least a bit more engaging / interesting. You know basically “do it” instead of just talking about it. Then maybe people would better understand “where I’m coming from”.
Graphics I am not thinking about much at all. I am not an artist and cannot make good artwork unless I want to spend more than 5 minutes on an enemy or other object and I really don’t want to. Especially when I can hire an artist to reskin it all easily at the end. I’m also strongly in the camp of gameplay over graphics in that I’d play games from 30 years ago if the gameplay is solid. It’s kind of funny (or at least timely) because as I write this my girlfriend is sitting here playing Super Mario Bros on the NES and I am stoked because Legend of Zelda just arrived today!
Anyway, thanks again! I might just go ahead and create an actual game out of this.
Have you considered making it an ‘endless runner’ shmup? After my last two plays, I defaulted to the old-defacto standard SHMUP style where you have ‘levels’, with end-bosses, and game progress. This morning though, I realized that that could be a LOT of work. So, instead, I was wondering if maybe it could be an endless runner shmup, with procedurally generated monster configurations. Along this line, here’s some random thoughts:
Endless Runner Space SHMUP
Points earned by distance, rather than killing enemies.
Monsters drop coins (or maybe seeds? - keeping with the food theme)
Game always starts easy, and increases in difficulty
The exact configuration of monsters and such is procedurally generated, such that each replay is a little different.
Some configurations could be rare - so maybe there’s a big tomato that drops a lot of seeds and takes a lot of hits to kill, though you only see him every once in a while. And maybe shooting him pushes him backwards, so you have to keep focused on him, while avoiding other things.
There’s a shop of sorts, where you spend seeds.
Weapon upgrades are much more frequent, and are time-limited - ex 6 seconds. The weapon strength, and time-lengths are upgrades.
There’s no built in armor, only shields. You start with a small shield, and you pick-up shield boosts. Possible upgrades here would be increasing max shield strength, slowly recharging shield power, amount of shield in pickups.
Lots of upgrade possibilities including crazy-powered weapons, invulnerability, fast-boost-fly-speed, and so on.
The benefit of an infinite runner type is you don’t have to develop a long story with perfectly balanced escalation. Yes, you would still have to develop a variety of boss-mobs, upgrades, and monster types. If the controls were changed slightly (ie. auto-fire), the game could probably work on mobile. A full PC SHMUP would likely need a LOT more than just being an infinite runner.
Look at the blue flamingo a cool little SHMUP where they modelled everything by hand (even the explosions), the only problem is that the gameplay was kind of weak they kept recycling the 2 stages over and over again (and got low review scores).
Look at this game where you control 2 characters at the same time and its getting press (raised €30k on kickstarter).
People like new ideas, I think your game has everything you need (I guess you would just need to play up the uniqueness abit more), it has a unique concept that you can sell to the press. It has a different looking art style. All you need to do is flesh it out. If you go with the mario 3 approach with short levels, boss levels, and the overworld (and different worlds). You could even have branching paths if you saved all the carrots or not.
Dimension Drive looks like it would be a cool game. I like things like this. They came up with a cool way to add some depth to a shmup. The other one while looking quite nice in a realistic way is basically the standard run of the mill shmup. It is actually a nice comparison. The first has excellent realistic graphics, money earning and a shop for upgrades. The second has a mechanic which adds a lot of challenge and some depth. Even in the videos you can see which actually makes for a better playing game. Although I think definitely an upgrade shop and the money collecting mechanic can add a lot if well done. Basically that first game is a prime example of focusing on graphics over everything else. It makes an awesome first impression and then leaves you feeling empty.
Just wanted to say thanks for the positive feedback my little shmup experiment received. That helped to push me over the fence making the decision to actually approach it as a real game project. I’ll get back to my other project later on. Probably when the days are getting shorter and colder once again. That other game is based on using the same kind of stuff. More interaction, better AI, solid feedback, discovery, kind of an epic journey in its own simplistic way. A much bigger project for sure. The shmup is probably a perfect vehicle to do the same kind of stuff on a smaller scale. And just like I am using systems I created for that other game in the shmup, I am sure I will end up creating some stuff for the shmup that I can use for the other bigger game.
So… let’s see… asteroid fields, more enemies, more weapons, more interaction, more AI, mini bosses, bosses, different paths. Sounds like a good list. I will get started on it tonight. Thanks again!
