"Handmade" textures

[mr_Necturus]

Hello all!

Here I want to speak about “handmade” textures.

I have long been concerned about this issue. Its start when I began to work in video games field. And I think this problem is familar to many of 3D artists.

In a nutshell, this problem can be described as follows:

Textures that made on the basis of photographs in many cases difficult to reconcile with the design of the game. This is very much in fantasy games, where they are especially stark contrast with the models. But worst of all when the game design have more or less cartoon style.

So I started to look around and think. And now I tend not to use photographs, but all textures to paint in Photoshop. Even when I am doing texture for grounds, grass, trees, metal …

Here some pictues. You can see the difference: On picture number 1 I used texture of grass that was made with help of camera. On all the other pictures I used textures that I painted myself.

For me there is no doubt that the cartoon spider, which is used painted texture is much better combined with the backround is using painted textures.

Besides of this painted textures have another huge advantage. They can be easly modifed and adapt for many purposes. Since all elements are at different Photoshop levels, textures can be changed as wanted.

With only one such texture 3d artist can create different variants and moods in 5 min. From very natural to very fantastic. From very happy to very depressed ones. (Drawing Number 6, 7 and 8 use the same texture that you see in the picture number 2)

In my opinion these all more than offset one lack of such textures. This lack is: its takes a few hours to make such texture depend on complexity.

Will be glad to hear you opinion, guys. And sorry for my English. Hope its understandable at least.

P.S. Posted pictures I made in 3D MAX. But I am sure that all I was said will be true for Unity as well.
Spider has 3 textures (diffuse, specular and normals), All ground materials use 2 textures (in diffuse and specular channels). Scene has 2 lights: main light from above/front. And light that influence only on ground specular from the back/above.

[mr_Necturus]

additional pictures for my post

[mr_Necturus]

additional pictures for my post

[Word]

nothing wrong with that, and it helps to establish video game making as an art.

[n0mad]

I feel you on that “problem”

Same choice had to be made for my game, and it ended in being all handmade.

Anyway I never really liked photo-inspired textures, they always looked like “soul lacking” to me (but it’s only personal opinion).
But I have to recognize some of the AAA games ones are really jaw dropping.

About the production discussion, I found a workflow that is working very well actually :

• first draw the basic flattened colors in Illustrator, plus adding light effects, layer mode combinations, gradients and all the procedural stuff,
• and then add custom pen tablet works (shades, lights, tints, additional handmade textures) into an image editor, with pen tablet

The result is far more precise than jumping directly to pen tablet working, and even let me preview how my models will look before putting huge illustrative works into it, thanks to that Illustrator step.

With the latest Blizzard’s World of Warcraft : Cataclysm, there were some development process leaks over the net (Skywall pictures, can’t find them atm), and they showed some WIP artworks for textures. This made me discover an interesting additional process : using sketches for early texturing. Just like traditional cartoon animation, in fact
It seems obvious written like that, but I didn’t find this method to be evident when working : when you know where to draw this or that, you don’t necessarily want to use sketches on your 3D model, you just want the cleanest possible result.

But here, sketches is able to give kind of on-the-fly new ideas that I wouldn’t have seen by only focusing on the 2D element.

[mr_Necturus]

@""

I feel you on that “problem”

Same choice had to be made for my game, and it ended in being all handmade.

Anyway I never really liked photo-inspired textures, they always looked like “soul lacking” to me (but it’s only personal opinion).
But I have to recognize some of the AAA games ones are really jaw dropping.

About the production discussion, I found a workflow that is working very well actually :

• first draw the basic flattened colors in Illustrator, plus adding light effects, layer mode combinations, gradients and all the procedural stuff,
• and then add custom pen tablet works (shades, lights, tints, additional handmade textures) into an image editor, with pen tablet

The result is far more precise than jumping directly to pen tablet working, and even let me preview how my models will look before putting huge illustrative works into it, thanks to that Illustrator step.

With the latest Blizzard’s World of Warcraft : Cataclysm, there were some development process leaks over the net (Skywall pictures, can’t find them atm), and they showed some WIP artworks for textures. This made me discover an interesting additional process : using sketches for early texturing. Just like traditional cartoon animation, in fact
It seems obvious written like that, but I didn’t find this method to be evident when working : when you know where to draw this or that, you don’t necessarily want to use sketches on your 3D model, you just want the cleanest possible result.

But here, sketches is able to give kind of on-the-fly new ideas that I wouldn’t have seen by only focusing on the 2D element.

I am agree with your position regarding photo-inspired textures.

Where I can see results of your work, by the way?

[n0mad]

@""

I am agree with your position regarding photo-inspired textures.

Where I can see results of your work, by the way?

Oh sorry, I should have put a link.
From this page to the end of the thread are the latest textures.
(I love your spider btw)

[mr_Necturus]

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@""

I am agree with your position regarding photo-inspired textures.

Where I can see results of your work, by the way?

Oh sorry, I should have put a link.
From this page to the end of the thread are the latest textures.
(I love your spider btw)

Thank you n0mad!
You made very interesting design. Is it your first game?

[n0mad]

@""

@""

@""

I am agree with your position regarding photo-inspired textures.

Where I can see results of your work, by the way?

Oh sorry, I should have put a link.
From this page to the end of the thread are the latest textures.
(I love your spider btw)

Thank you n0mad!
You made very interesting design. Is it your first game?

Thanks
(I don’t want to hijack this cool thread with another subject, though, but it’s my first “real” game yes. First “more than just a unfinished hobby project”, to say ^^).

[Vert]

Very informative post. Thank you for sharing. I have found your conclusions to be true. Photo based textures usually end up not feeling right or looking right unless a lot of time is spent on post processing effects.

I personally like to hand make all my textures and have found that for some complex textures it is best to use a photo as a base and use some filters and brushes to make it match my other textures. I have not found an easy way to draw things such as gravel and some variants of concrete etc. I hope this inspires and informs other users as these are great points to consider when making game art.

[n0mad]

@""

I have not found an easy way to draw things such as gravel and some variants of concrete etc. I hope this inspires and informs other users as these are great points to consider when making game art.

Yeah, “little nature things” are a pain !

That’s where illustrator is very useful, as you can create a replicable object, and then spread multiple instances of it, change their shape, color, etc…
I saved many hours of handmaking with this software

[mr_Necturus]

@""

@""

I have not found an easy way to draw things such as gravel and some variants of concrete etc. I hope this inspires and informs other users as these are great points to consider when making game art.

Yeah, “little nature things” are a pain !

That’s where illustrator is very useful, as you can create a replicable object, and then spread multiple instances of it, change their shape, color, etc…
I saved many hours of handmaking with this software

Thank you, MakerOfGames!

I am just painting texture as if it was real canvas oil paint… And trying not to stick to reality, but more relay on my memories of it Something sort of impressionism.

[Vert]

I was able to make a nice toony gravel with some filters in photoshop. Here is what I came up with using a photo as a base. I think it turned out well. I am tying to make my game toonish styled, inspired by Team Fortress 2.

Ah, that’s a very good idea! Let yourself try to remember nature to create textures. I like your thinking! Very inspiring! Excellent textures by the way!

[mr_Necturus]

@""

I was able to make a nice toony gravel with some filters in photoshop. Here is what I came up with using a photo as a base. I think it turned out well. I am tying to make my game toonish styled, inspired by Team Fortress 2.

Ah, that’s a very good idea! Let yourself try to remember nature to create textures. I like your thinking! Very inspiring! Excellent textures by the way!

Thank you very much!
I am glad if it help.

Yes you have very nice result. I sometimes using filters too. But in very rear case. Its more because I love to paint textures myself. Especially nature and armor textures.

[Vert]

@""

Yes you have very nice result. I sometimes using filters too. But in very rear case. Its more because I love to paint textures myself. Especially nature and armor textures.

Thanks you! I’m glad you like it. I wish I had your love for painting textures. I usually end up using filters and multiple layers to create all my textures from scratch in Photoshop. Then I touch them up using my Intuos3 art tablet. It’s a shame I have that technology but am under utilizing it. I should use it more often.

[anon_74970857]

We’ve mainly been using photos here at work just because of the time element. We aren’t budgeted much time to get everything done.

But once in a while there just isn’t a good enough photo reference to work from, so a texture needs to be made from scratch.

It’s a lot more satisfying, but dang it takes a long time for some.

It’s especially satisfying if you could get it the object to fit in with other objects that are using photo-based textures.

[mr_Necturus]

@""

We’ve mainly been using photos here at work just because of the time element. We aren’t budgeted much time to get everything done.

But once in a while there just isn’t a good enough photo reference to work from, so a texture needs to be made from scratch.

It’s a lot more satisfying, but dang it takes a long time for some.

It’s especially satisfying if you could get it the object to fit in with other objects that are using photo-based textures.

Hey WinningGuy!

I am fully agree with you. I want jast to notice that althouw you spend much time to make “handmade” textures it worth to do.

Once you have even small library of such textures you can to reuse it in other projects. And as I said in my first post here:
Same natural texture for almost real grass after 5 min of work can be transformed to texture from aliens planet.

[mr_Necturus]

When I am thinking why, actually, camera taken textures not fit good to many of 3d projects, the only answer coming into my head is:

When you are trying to make your own world you need to build it all yourself. Even “atoms” of it.

So if you trying to steal peaces from another, real word it looks like an unnatural layer of makeup on face of a provincial actor.

Do someone have better answer for the question?

[GeneralGrant]

@""

When I am thinking why, actually, camera taken textures not fit good to many of 3d projects, the only answer coming into my head is:

When you are trying to make your own world you need to build it all yourself. Even “atoms” of it.

So if you trying to steal peaces from another, real word it looks like an unnatural layer of makeup on face of a provincial actor.

Do someone have better answer for the question?

Actually, It’s more how you use it. I have seen many models textured with stuff from websites like cgtextures.com that turned out amazing! While, if you are creating a more toony/WoW look, it would be better to just draw your texture.

[n0mad]

@""

When I am thinking why, actually, camera taken textures not fit good to many of 3d projects, the only answer coming into my head is:

When you are trying to make your own world you need to build it all yourself. Even “atoms” of it.

So if you trying to steal peaces from another, real word it looks like an unnatural layer of makeup on face of a provincial actor.

Do someone have better answer for the question?

If there was to be a technical answer, I guess it would be because of texture lighting

I was teached in my art school times that in classic drawing/painting, light is the first link between elements (that’s even Da Vinci words).
But in real life pictures, lights are so complicated and so subtle that it’s nearly impossible to create proper links with a handmade texture (or it takes a lot of time/light experience).

That’s even why games entirely hand drawn kind of feel more visually coherent. Artists have better control over texture lights.

What’s amazing is that one gamer doesn’t need to come from art schools for his eye to see any lighting illogism