How to protect your ideas?

News & General Discussion
1

Hello everyone.

i have been meaning to introduce myself for awhile now.

i am a unaccomplished writer, i have a lot of trouble with the scope and length of stories. i want to turn each story into the lord of the rings. i just cant do short stories.

so one day i was playing minecraft and just said **** it i am going to make a game! i have no experience whatsoever in programming or 3d modeling.

i found various engines( cry, udk, Unity) and blender.

2-3 months and alot coffee :slight_smile: later i have a working proof of concept. very basic but all basic features such as movement animation and environment are at a point where i believe the concept is clearly displayed and implemented.

now one of my biggest fears is staring me in the face.

how do i protect the concept/ ideas that i have created?

i desperately want to show off my accomplishments for my ego and for the criticism that will help me refine my concept into a full game.

are my fears imagined or are they real? is this something i should be concerned about or would the posting of a gameplay video be part of that protection.

yes i realize i am a bit paranoid…

and also with my first post i have to say thank you to all the people who have come before me and asked and answered such wonderful question. none of what i have made would be possible with out you. i love you unity answers (and forums :))

2

You’re going to get a lot of “Ideas mean nothing, only implementation.” Let me be the first to disagree.

Implementation -is- the vast majority of it. But if you do happen to have a novel idea, approach, or something that could really make a neat game…and you blab about it early on, and an experienced dev team rolls out a full game with that idea in 6 months…well, you know :slight_smile:
I would suggest you do two things: Post whatever screenshots you are comfortable with, but if you are really batshit paranoid, just keep a personal dev blog. A private one. Post whatever you want…it will keep you going, give you encouragement. Maybe give access to a few people you trust, friends or family who support and encourage you.

I feel like you’re getting kinda worried in advance. Seeing as you are new to game development, and I am still somewhat new, let me tell you: It’s a long road. It is not a sprint, it is a marathon. But, stick with it and you’ll probably achieve your goal. See my sig.

I experimented with game dev back in…uh the 80’s. I didn’t continue, for various reasons. I always wanted to get back into it. Minecraft was THE game that made me say…I’m going to do something similar. So, I started a project to make an open source MineCraft framework. I didn’t finish, because I realize I really wanted something else, but I made a good effort. But it was my very first “real” attempt at game programming, and I learned so much.

Your ideas will probably change between now, and when you actually start coding them. If you’re like me when I started, I had some good ideas that I wanted to keep a lid on. And they were/are good ideas. But you won’t believe how much some of them have changed, because

  1. Programming/graphics cards/physics don’t work that way
  2. I realized it was a crappy idea
  3. I realized it would be a pain in the ass for players
  4. I realized there was a BETTER way

Many times I have started to put feature X in the system…and realized these things. Big deal. You are the potter, shape the clay how you will. If you have to yank it out and put in something different, just do it. If you see it as something that “OMG I have to get done so everyone can play and throw money at it and tell me how awesome I am”, you will have a very hard time. If you look at it as something you are doing for yourself primarily, and it is a learning process, and you have all of the time in the world, it might be easier.

Also…since you pretty much have no programming experience, I think that is going to be your biggest learning curve. You an google and copy/paste code, but knowing a good overall design is something that could help you a lot and takes experience.

So, lean on these forums. Ask things like “How can I call this function, wait three seconds, then call another” in the scripting forums. Until you build on your experience, you will need time AND to lean on others for direction at times. Just be sure at least make an effort on your own to research things first…google is magic.

Anyway, just my $0.02 :slight_smile:

3

You have people you show the work to sign an NDA form…non-disclosure agreement. If you want to protect the idea on the internet, simply be careful with what you share online. It’s that easy. You can market your stuff without giving away all of your details, look at how the movie industry does it with film trailers…or even game trailers for that matter.

4

hello JC i feel like i am saying hi to a old friend for the first time. i have your minepackage it was one of the things i was playing with :slight_smile: but on that note it is not a mc clone it was just the realization that a game dosnt have to have a story to be fun.

gameplay is what makes it fun!!! i know right, simple and something i am sure all of you have long since realized but it just clicked and to keep a long story short here i am.

i realize that i am not sitting on the next great game here but its my game ya know?

its not just an idea. it is a fully implemented idea. admittedly it is not a full game just the skeleton of a game.

i feel no rush to complete it but honest feedback is priceless, and before posting videos or screenshots i want to protect my work.

and yes programming is the biggest obstacle but unityscript is/has proven to be very learn able on the fly.

not to mention the unity answers section where every question i have had was already answered.

5

thank you for the very practical and helpful advice. its nice to have an excuse to check out new games and movies :slight_smile:

6

Just wanted to say, you’re one of the better posters on the Unity forums. Great post :slight_smile:

I’m one of those paranoid guys who’s worried about sharing WIP stuff too early, because I’ve seen it bite so many people in the rear so often.

7

A nice strawman, but I’d love to see an actual documented, high profile case of this happening. The closest I can think of is some flash/browser clones of Fez on sites like NewGrounds, with the rotation mechanic (although technically I’d say Paper Mario did it first). Either way, take note that no one remembers these flash games, and it had absolutely not effect on Fez’s success.

8

I’m developing a game’s universe by putting everything–storyline, character profiles, weapon balancing, everything–on a publicly viewable (but privately editable!) wiki. The ideas are protected by the simple fact that they existed before any implementation did, and if anyone attempts to implement the idea before me, it’ll be pretty clear that the idea was stolen. This, combined with the fact that the wiki is so thorough that it would be absolutely blatantly obvious if someone attempted to steal the idea, would be my security blanket. It’s like game developers seeding torrents that pirate their own games–if people like the idea, it shouldn’t be a question of how they go about using it, but rather, how much they really do like it.

That isn’t exactly going to stop people from stealing ideas, but hey, it does at least give you leverage against such practice.

On topic, it seems to me like you may just be getting worked up preemptively about something that you really shouldn’t worry too much about. If you’re really paranoid, keep everything under wraps–but don’t be afraid to find ways to make it easier for your co-developers and contractors to collaborate. If you become their only go-to guy, you are suddenly the weakest link in your own game’s development–everyone has to go to you, and you don’t have time to deal with everyone.

Just tread lightly. It’s really the best advice anyone can give. :slight_smile:

9

thanks :slight_smile:

10

If it makes you feel safer… EVERYBODY has their own amazing idea that they don’t want to share with anybody else.
Then you might respond by saying “No, no, but my idea is extra special and amazing”.

If it makes you feel safer… EVERYBODY has their own amazing idea they think is extra special and amazing…

Once your idea is implemented and working well and the mechanics are in place, and the idea works in concept, then start getting it developed, get everyone to sign NDA’s and the usual… the bottom line is if you’re working with other developers there’s nothing stopping them from making an offshoot of your idea.
Honestly, when people find out your idea and compare it to their idea they will most likely think ‘meh, I like my idea better’. So you don’t have much to worry about.

All I can say is get those NDA’s signed thats about all the insurance you got.

11

All I have to say is The Simpsons already did it.

:slight_smile:

12

Well said. The fact is any proof and concepts posting by date or other proof of you comming up with the idea first will do.
Second take some time reading through these forums and you will probably find a large number of posts saying nice idea but mine is better. Each of us has already fallen in love with our own idea’s.
But if you want a way to do a poor man copywrite then send it to the writers guild of america for $50 and get a reference number as proof.
We have that and a filing of our tab line but lawyers costed us quite a bit.

What ever you do just make sure your stuff is dated and your good.

13

I’d rather throw $50 out the window. You can’t copyright ideas.

14

Good point. But how often do you see a high profile dev blog, detailing all of their ideas, start to finish?
This is a bigger problem for indies, imo. I do this in my spare time. It might take me two, maybe three years to get something really solid going, and I am still new to a lot of this.
How long would it take a seasoned game dev? Or three of them, working together? In those three years, they could very well be sitting on a heaping pile of cash. Small consolation to me, aka Mr. Blabbermouth.

And can you imagine Apple announcing "Hey, everyone. We are going to make a new device, called iHologram. It’s like a holographic smartphone, sits on your shoulder. You can make it look like a dragon, a unicorn, you buy different models and animations for the hologram. It’s awesome. And, we are going to blab EVERYTHING about it in a blog, as we are making everything work. "

There is a reason why NOBODY does that. Because as soon as they posted how they were going to do the hologram tech, a freaking army of guys in China would have it on the market so fast Steve Job’s head would spin. And everyone would talk about how dirty that was, poor stupid Apple, while they enjoyed their awesome iHologramMadeInChinas and Apple’s stuff shows up 1 year later but nobody gives a crap. The market has been sold already. So Apple shows it AFTER they have it working. And people still try to steal it, but hey…Apple got there first, and sometimes that really counts.

15

Read this: “No one Cares About Your Cool Game Idea” and then you’ll be ready to ask this question: What do I need to succeed?

What you need is: MORE FAILURES. That’s what stands between you and success. So, your objective is to fail as quickly as possible. Fail doesn’t mean quit or give up, it means COMPLETING something small, publishing it, and truly failing. This requires something you can build in 8-12 weeks.

The hard part of success is learning to fail! Because failure is a part of the process that leads to success! If you embrace your failures, you can learn from them. You will improve! Then, you can do it all over again. Release something in 8-12 weeks again! Fail again. Learn. Improve. Repeat until too good to ignore. It’s the surest path to success.

Still interested? Then, read ‘Mindset’ by Carol Dweck; and ‘So Good They Can’t Ignore You’ by Cal Newport; and ‘The Power of Habit’ by Duhrig; and ‘Great By Choice’ by Collins. From these books, I learned ‘growth mindset’, ‘deliberate practice’, ‘habits’, and ‘bullets-then-canonballs’.

My 3rd app is waiting for Apple’s approval right now. 8 weeks start to finish, and … I consider it a success.

Gigi

16

‘Three years’ is the same as, ‘I will never finish’.

I challenge you - build whatever you can build in 12 weeks! Start-to-finish! Release it. And then, watch it fail. So you can learn, improve, and do it all again. It’s not about showing the world ‘how awesome your idea is’ or ‘getting lots of kudos on your phat-skills!’ It’s about practicing things beyond your abilities, failing, and trying again, until one day, they aren’t.

Think about it,
Gigi.

17

I don’t know that this applies in this situation. I can see it being great if you have ideas for smaller projects, and learning is your focus.
[Edit] In the OP’s case, I can see how that would really help him get an understanding though, of programming and Unity. I guess I sort of did this when I worked on MinePackage, and the never mentioned sandbox space game that ground to a halt :slight_smile:

Notch started on Minecraft um…I’m not sure, but alpha was released in May, 2009. It was actually released in Nov, 2011. I think it’s safe to say it took him quite a bit longer than 12 months. He probably started sometime in 2008, maybe even 2007. I don’t think he was focused on phat skills, or showing the world how awesome he was. He had a vision of something he could make, that he was excited about, and he went for it. I doubt he saw the huge impact it would have when it started, or the mountains of cash he would end up with.

I think if you -know- for certain what you want to make, and you are pretty sure you can, then go for it even if it will take a few years. With my project, there is no technical reason I can’t do it, it’s just going to take a while.

Now, if I want some more advanced polish, I have to learn shaders. Something I’m in the process of doing :slight_smile:

18

  1. Forget the NDA notices. Without a lawyer, a badly written NDA may get you in more trouble than it may solve. Also, anyone in the industry may ignore you because they are problematic for them too (if they happen to be working on something similar now you have their signature about them seeing your stuff… gets messy fast)
    Besides. an NDA only protects from … well, disclosure. If you show it to a dev, and he thinks he can’t only duplicate it but also improve on it, all has to do is work on it, finish it, and ship a bit after you with a superior product. An NDA won’t stop that from happening.

  2. Your worries on people stealing your ideas should be inversely proportionate to how hard they are to implement. If you think you hit some very interesting niche, but also know that it’s VERY easy to implement then don’t show it to anyone you don’t trust A LOT until it’s ready to ship. If it’s interesting for a developer that sees it and easy to reproduce, then they may do so.

If it’s complex to implement, then no one is going to bother going out of their way of doing whatever they are doing to steal your project instead.

Regardless, I would say show it first to friends and family. Don’t show things around to stroke your ego, show them around when you THINK you are nearly ready to ship them, only to see their reactions. Feedback should not be sought to bathe in praise, it should be sought for reality checks.

You don’t want pats in the back; you want slaps in the face. That’s the only way you will improve your product (after certain time working on something, you get too attached to judge by yourself.) :slight_smile:

19

If you are new, learning should be your focus. You will NOT do a successful project on your first try.

Nop. Notch made games for 4 years for King.com. He started Minecraft in May10, 2009, and went beta May 17 of the same year. Also: minecraft was just a rippoff of a game called Infiniminer. The guy was not even designing as much as he was cloning another game he discovered. (More on Minecraft’s development can be read here)

A lot of people like to bring up the story of Minecraft as an example of hitting off big solo and with your first effort, or how much time is not wasted time, but it’s not a good example of neither. He started taking money very early with a very very barebones beta version of the game, and he had 4 years of experience making games.

20

Ok, I’ll agree as a first project, it’s probably not a good idea to tackle something big. With no experience at all, you have no idea really if your ideas or possible or not :slight_smile:

But, looking at the wiki…

So, just going by the wiki…beta was about 1.5 years AFTER alpha, and release was almost 1 year after beta. That’s 2.5 years from alpha to release. No mention of how long it took him to get to alpha…I am betting that he started in early to mid 2008, but that’s just a guess.

But, I’m not sure how this relates to the original point. I think I mostly agree with your statement here:

I agree with this. Most of all, I guess I feel that if others taking your ideas is a concern, then it’s best to have something in alpha/beta before you spread it around.