My Dream Project

I figured I’d write down a few of my big ideas, see what you people think about them… I’ve got them pretty much fleshed out on paper, but I’ve got a little more experience to gain before I work on them seriously. Maybe you can help me develop them further? Or tell me what you think?
Here’s my team collab post that prompted me…
(Tho I don’t expect these to happen any time soon. Heh.)

So in case you’re interested, among my ‘dream’ projects are:

(1) a FPS/RTS, where the two aspects are separate but integrated, so you can have as much or little of the skill/strategy side of things as you want; thus it plays to both player markets.
It’s also got a few improvements/changes to the typical fundamentals - i.e. more dynamic/interactive FPS mode, with movement that involves auto centers-of-gravity and balance in the typical WASD/Mouse; also with more grabbability everywhere (weapons, items, vehicles, other players) and an auto close combat mode that works with it (you can grab people and throw them around, melees are a little more dynamic).
RPS mode is based on gathered intel and chain of command rather than ‘shared sight’; the ONLY case you should actually see the whole map is with like a satellite or something. Vehicles and Buildings are V and B, not units. Oh and there are lots of different factions you can play, but basically 2 sides with different combinations available of equipment and such. Oh, and units are in squads.

Storyline is basically post-post-apocalyptic war (yes, sorta cliche), where civilization is rebuilding… again. You have ‘pockets’ of advanced civilization or technology people are holding onto; and people are just starting to try and create a large Alliance of post-modern fiefdoms; but you have the Anarchists wreaking anarchy, led by the Supreme Anarchist (oxymoron) and his posse. Eventually you have interdimensional aliens invade, driven from their home plane, to bring everyone together. And later on a ‘surprise’ faction joining the fray, who come from environmentalists who escaped to the other side of the moon.

(2) a RPG based off of a table game (like D’n’D except cooler) I’ve been running for around 10 years with some friends. I want it to eventually be a MMO, but it will be very untraditional (and don’t worry, it’s not one those newbie things, it’s a ‘dream project’, only for ‘someday’ or ‘That would be cool!’.). It’s two-tiered, so it’s got a Level-based system going underneath a Skill-based system; so you are essentially a ‘Guardian Angel’ of some sort ‘guiding’ different ‘assignments’ (or characters) in the real world. This means your chars spend time developing and using skills, while in the process you gain experience. Experience determines your level and gives you ‘Privelage Points’, used to ‘upgrade’ your characters with access to Magic, Technology, Nobility, Social Status, etc.
The world is sort of an ‘indirect sandbox’; that is, it is player influenced, but character run; the player can log out, but the characters don’t; they just go into an ‘inactive’ mode, where they will act as if on their own and follow out their ‘goals’ as planned by the player. Therefore, the player can be as deeply involved as desired, but this is not required to succeed in the game. While inactive, a character can go more ‘active’ as controlled by the computer in special circumstances - this is basically so some jerk doesn’t kill your high level merchant while you’re offline. For this purpose characters have some sort of character ‘insurance’ that basically means he is more resilient to a certain ‘level’ of spec. circumstances.
Also - generally, since a character is part of and influences the game-world, if he dies, he dies. This can sometimes be counteracted or prevented thru PP spending, etc. to get him back.
I’ve also included a more balanced character role system; It’s not like WOW where the entire populace is a bunch of hack’n’slash adventurers and stationary NPC’s whose purpose in life is to give adventurers quests. There are actually farms and markets; cities have communities and government. This makes the game cater to, and give a role to, many different styles of gameplay - and hopefully, it should give those inevitable socializers something to do, in helping run the world, instead of standing around and taking up bandwidth. (sorry, socializers, but I’m NOT one of you.) No, but seriously, they should have some pretty cool features too…
See this article for a more authoritative view on this. I’ve tried to balance it so different play-styles can be involved; and if you don’t like to play a certain type of character, you don’t have to spend a lot of time on them; however they all help to keep the world running, and to a large extent depend on each other to be a successful community. (Even killers, tho I want to minimize them, will play a role. They will essentially become the bandits and thieves and corrupt politicians; which will give the legitimate characters something more to do.)
Another effect of the two-tier system is that a large player-base is not exactly necessary to keep the world turning, at least from the game-play point of view; the world will keep going even with very few players (Though from a money standpoint that might not be the case… hehe…), and still maintain a very realistic population ratio. (i.e. 95% are normal people, 5% are people with special skills/position, i.e. adventurers, magicians, engineers, nobles, etc.) In fact, the player might not have a clue as to whether a character is player-controlled or not. (Still playing around with this)
EDIT: In case it wasn’t clear: Gameplay is a lot like most RPG’s, except it can be a little more ‘automatic’ than normal; as in, click and move/attack, based on skill; can also ‘help’ aim, guide direction, etc. The usual ‘character select’ screen is where you see your stats as a ‘Guardian’, and do stuff to your characters. Your Chars can’t see magical names above people’s heads, that’s weird. BUT being a ‘Guardian’ affords you ‘spiritual eyes’ which allow you to see most standard GUI elements.

Storyline/Setting involves something simlilar… it’s a planetary ‘exodus’ followed by a ‘generation amnesia’ (as in war kills off most who remember), and remnants of magical, societal, and technical science exist as ‘artifacts’ to be researched and found. You can do pretty much any character you want, as skill sets learned determines your ‘class’ and your profession can end up being anything you want. You also have a very ‘heroic’ narrative - as in the Player Chars are the ‘guided’ or ‘blessed’ ones. The plot is character-driven and non-linear; there are no world-generated, guided ‘quests’, but society builds unique tasks and such instead. So a character can do whatever he wants.

and (3) I’m also working on a simple RPG with a few twists; but it’s basically centric to the fact that you, the player, are a big floating hand in the sky. That means you can and will interact with the environment, and units; and they will interact back (i.e. enemies will attack you, or run away…). Several other elements are added to build on the idea, i.e. a lot of ‘drag and drop’ and picking stuff up; a ‘shelf’ with inventory ‘boxes’ you can put stuff in; buttons, levers, bridges, etc.; a collection of ‘tools’ which serve as alternate cursors with special actions.
Control is a little more dynamic, and less direct. Because you are a hand in the sky, all you can really do is point at things… so you use ‘primary’, then ‘secondary’ selection; gestures (circling units instead of box-selecting, or drawing walls to build); ‘scribbling out’ gestures, and ‘sweep’ movements (using the mouse to swing the sword tool), etc. Units are pretty much one unit per race, and each race has special properties and ‘preferences’ which you can mix and match to a certain extent. This all amounts to more of an indirect, ‘herding’ method of controlling units, and ultimately a different play experience.

Storyline involves a big hand in the sky, and miniature mythical ‘creatures’ - i.e. elves, imps, dwarves, goblins, fairies, etc… - but not the traditional, the original/cartoonized versions. They are all pretty dumb. The setting is a miniaturized nature world - mushrooms for trees, ponds, tree stumps, you name it. Um you just want to get these special ‘gloves’ to improve your abilities; but it’s more designed for quick, simple, intriguing gameplay that you can jump into whenever you want, but still improve if you decide to go it alone for a while.

Oh, and I’m working on a 3d maze game, featuring a ball character, with a ‘club’ at my university for a learning project.

(As you can see, I like trying to integrate seemingly opposite genres to try and create something unique and dynamic.) Tell me what you think; i’m open to ideas. I’m also open to hearing/critiquing yours.
(I know it’s unlikely, and if you did it would be a different game, but… Don’t steal my ideas, thank you. I’m a little paranoid.)

I don’t think that FPS and RTS, in a more common sense, works together very well because the FPS part most probably disables the RTS part from beeing effective or the RTS part prevents that other more interesting aspects you might want to see in a FPS can’t shine this much. Then again what doesn’t work for a full game can work out for one level quite well. Switching modes is annoying but things could improve if you for instance could command some AI units via voice input.

True, and I’ve considered that; that, at least for me, was one of the intriquing aspects of it. Because in a traditional sense, it wouldn’t work; so I have to tweak things to make both things awesome.

Essentially, it is more of a FPS with RTS elements/mode involved - that being, a simple, RTS style format for giving and recieving ‘orders’. Thus the use of a chain of command; so you can give orders as far down the line or as basically as needed, but you can also recieve orders, as in any normal military endeavor. So the ‘RTS’ aspect isn’t a whole lot like a traditional RTS, but I still think it could be a fun and effective way to play.

What aspects do you think might be affected most from a FPS standpoint?

One major thing I can see is being able to do what you want… but to be honest, that’s the part I hate about most FPS’s - regardless of the game, you are the only unit doing anything useful. The others just run around shooting each other.

Any strategy turns into, ‘How can I capture all of the bases fast enough to win before my allies inevitably abandon them so they are taken by one lowly chump and I lose?’; or ‘Shoot all of the badguys, sit there until their numbers dwindle enough to win and hope they don’t sneak some lowly chump in and take all of my bases.’ Advanced strategies involve sneaking past their mass of units and taking all of their bases, and hope they don’t somehow beat your friends, which they always do.

That is why I think the chain of command is a good idea; AI can still be simple, as they don’t have to plan for everyone and the commands and such are simple; but it can be very flexible and smart too, because it essentially functions like a pyramid-shaped ‘swarm logic’ AI. It also adds a story-line and game-play aspect to it of having to ‘rise thru the ranks’; and as you do, you can be more in charge of yourself (FPS) and others (RTS).

Of course, you can always drop down into the front ranks if you want, and lead the head of the battle. This adds a whole lot of depth to the available tactics, and also the professional ‘paths’ or ‘roles’ you want to take; and you can always switch around, and have a few favorite ‘roles’ or configurations. And as far as voice-command goes… I don’t want it to be a chat-room but that could always be implemented; or I could just use dedicated order functions. Either way, you need to be able to give/receive the same orders from both computers and players.

Personally, I prefer that to the ‘run-around-and-shoot-each-other-until-somebody-loses’ method; and you can always have a mode where orders are on a free-for-all, for the times when you just want to jump in and shoot everyone. Does that make sense to you? What do you think?

Oh, and for anyone who posts I’m interested in both ‘That would/wouldn’t work because of X’ and ‘I would/wouldn’t like that because of X’ points of view - I’d just prefer a distinction. In other words, if you think it would/wouldn’t work, consider whether that’s because it just w/w’nt, or because you personally w/wn’t like that playstyle or whatever. That helps me know if I need to fix it, or possibly expand/change it to fit different playstyle preferences.

(1) http://www.isotx.com/ Check out Iron Grip: Warlord. Might not be exactly what you want to do but it’s a pretty cool take on combining FPS/RTS.

Hrm looked it up… I agree the concept is kinda cool; I looked at a few reviews and it looks like it didn’t pan out very well. Red flashing lights came on when it said it was their ‘first commercial game’… so I don’t know what I should have expected really.

But it looks like they didn’t put the different aspects together very well… I think I’ve got this worked out pretty well, I wanted to specifically make sure of that; one issue IGW had was that you were required to play all three aspects - at the same time; and further, they all never really stood up to normal genre gameplay standards (FPS was on your own and underpowered, AI was useless, RTS was too hard to switch to and didn’t do much good, and Tower Defense concepts were weak). In mine, on the other hand, they are both supposed to be very thought out, and fleshed out so that either is a good gameplay experience; and it’s designed not so you have to play both at the same time, it’s so you can play one or the other, in the ratio/style that you want.

So I don’t think I’ll be having that problem.

As far as storyline goes - I personally Warlord’s storyline and premise is stupid. Goad the huge, incoming force to firebomb your city? Um… Ok. Get over-run or defend until I get flamed. I think I quit already. No, but seriously - No character or world connection, and little moral ‘feel-goods’ that come with it = I don’t want to play this game. My storyline comes with the ability to be the badguys… which is sometimes a little shifty. But either way, they are all just trying to take over; and it just leads up to a ‘union’ in defense of the planet, which is always a cliche but standard fallback. The worst I might do is throw in a few Arthas elements in there; where I have a good guy you start to like go bad, and you have to watch it, and there’s nothing you can do about it. But I’m not going to make you actually play them, so it’ll be safe I think.

But all of that is just from browsing reviews… I also heard it had some decent multiplayer gameplay. Anyway, back to original conversation topic:…

Regardless of how Warlord turned out, I’m not releasing until I have a solid product; this might mean I have to accomplish smaller projects first, and make them solid and figure things out, but unless I have concrete gameplay, storyline, and overall structure, it’s not going to be ‘finished’; and I intend to use people who know what they are doing, to give me some pretty critical feedback until I get the result I want. (<-- that, my friends, is a long sentence. I need to be more concise.)

Thanks for the posts btw. :slight_smile:

I think it’s important that i as a player can experience the hopefully great story. Obviously it also would be fun if you’re too lame the mission gets solved before you, needs balancing, you shouldn’t do this all time. A completely open world would take too many ressources but you can fake this by such possible events, good level design, NPCs and story telling.

To me introducing RTS makes sense in situations like for instance if you enter a new complex like a deck with two levels, you’re a level above so that you can sneak into the situation, on the lower lever you also recognise a unit of yours which you can contact and command, after the invesigations you command them in order to take over control of the lower level or distract them enough for enabling you to get into the action in FPS style as well.

What i don’t see working out is ressource management. Sure you could free/defend three towers in a FPS style to enable the production of enough energy for opening and sustaining a portal, next area or whatever but that’s not really groovy. To me this more comes down to story telling, interesting places, the atmosphere and situations and then it ends up beeing level design and other aspects again and then you can use it in a small as well as in a big scope like, dunno, for instance beeing stranded on a ice moon, waiting for the sun to free your frozen up ship with you beeing trapped in a cave/cargo of your ship where you have to keep some bacteria colony happy in order to provide enough energy for you beeing able to survive up to harvesting ressources from a asteroid belt taking the hostile and dynamic environment into account as well.

So i like it when the shooting works, if it’s story driven, i want some depth, it should be for adults not teenagers , no military game, maybe some RPG elements. Doom 3, Half Life, System-/Bioshock, these work for me.

It is certainly an achievable goal to do an RTS/FPS, but until you’ve made one or the other nobody should expect a hybrid from you.

Really? You should buy it and play it. At least watch some of the videos. Sounds like you googled and read random reviews. It’s RTCW meets C&C. I personally don’t think they missed a beat. It ain’t AAA but it sure ain’t sucky.

I have a dream project too I’m making a RPG game like Mass Effect, it’s name is Black Hole :smile:

Combining FPS and RTS is very possible: http://www.naturalselection2.com/

Battlezone 2 was cool :wink:

Sweet. If I could actually watch videos on this computer it’d be even sweeter.

That’s a really cool looking game, I’ve gotta look that up; I’ve got a similar approach, but imagine adding chain of command; so everyone can be a commander, but they all depend on each other to get orders done (which isn’t going to be a problem with mostly computers… unless I want to make like a unique campaign comrade that likes to do his own thing… Hmmmmm…).

For your FPS/RTS you should check out Savage: The Battle for Newerth and Savage 2: A Tortured Soul. Fun games. I used to play them with my brother, many fun nights playing.

There on the bottom half of this page:

http://www.s2games.com/games.php