Torque vs Unity (again)

Honestly, Torque has full source and full game engine will unlimited updates for $100, Unity is $1500 and most sales are to Indie which is a real pain in the ass on costs. Torque may not be as user friendly but still can dish out what Unity can with the right programmers.

Now Unity is not money hungry though they could have some deals and events for a lowered price for Pro and include mobile add-ons for free not additional cost because that it stupid. Unity will also charge an upgrade fee on Unity 4.0x since it will begin a new version entirely. Now that too is insane specially when were mostly all Indie here. But to be fair most features found in unity are in most other engines that are free like Cry Engine, Hero Engine, and some smaller unpopular ones. Now they may not be as easy to use though. But just because Unity has a free version doesn’t mean they will still be loyal to their free users over their paid ones.

free users make you more money than you would think, they make more Youtube videos, talk about your engine to friends, family, co-workers, public area, news forums, game community’s, etc. They also make up most of this sites traffic each and everyday. They give you the audience you need to gain those few paid licenses unity gets every day or week. So unity you should start taking care of your free users more and giving more back to them and get some discounts rolling.

Adobe in most cases if your a college student or in Europe attend a University for this kind of stuff you will get free adobe software either by financial aid, student discount or is included with schooling. 3DS max, Maya, Z-brush, etc all cost a ton except for Z-brush they are a bit cheaper, but blender can do mostly what they can and is free, and Autodesk allows for student licenses and you can use a student license to make a game but just need to buy a full license to release your game. Also full licenses also usually come with higher education if your in the right school and learning 3D art. Or at the very least a nice discount.

Torque is great
But not really in the field to even be compared to Unity, its along the lines of C4: great to use for shooter, hell for anything else.

Torque is primarily Windows only (Advanced Lighting never worked on OSX), not counting the other 9 platforms.

You need to understand the fact that the various platforms is a pretty solid benefit and one of the large reasons it grew as it did (torque once used to be larger, then Instant Action buried it alive basically. Now its slowly regaining strength and focus and trying to get back on track to be an engine, not a proof that the V12 engine was a great base that never lifed up to its power ;))

as for the student part: unity has student licenses too.

Unity student license costs. It is not free and you are still charge annually. Also torque is not just built for FPS or shooter in general. Torque iOS, Torque 2D, Torque 3D, and Torque X. Even if you bought all those engines you will still pay around 30% or less of one Unity pro license. Plus you get source free. if you wish to add another license for a team member or friend you only pay $50 which again are deals unity lacks and are costing them more than making them money.

Torque is almost ready for Linux, they do Mac, and Pc. They are even really heavy set on the Xbox Live Arcade.

1.2 for Torque is almost here and price has increased to $179 so they must be getting their fans back.

That’s great for torque users, but I would say that Unity is in a different ballpark because of how integrated everything is. Unless you can show me that Torque is as easy to use as Unity, I find ease of use and how integrated everything is to make Unity well worth its higher price tag.

too true, or automatic transmission vehicles would not be more expensive than manual. More labor and money on the developer’s end has been put to make sure the end-user has an easier experience.

Well ease of use is great and all but useless to those who cannot afford it.

So everything should be cheap and a pain in the ass to use?

Do you hunt scavenge your own food every night?

Well I do believe even Unity has things that are still a pain in the ass to use. Also if its broken and you can fix it why throw it away specially if it was cheap to begin with? Plus you get source with Torque so you can make the engine how you want it if your a decent programmer and it only cost you $100-$179, a fraction compared to Unity pro on top of any add-ons for Mobile devices.

I am a fan of many engines, but price is key and essential to me personally.

Unity is over priced hands down. let me explain why. $1500 for pro, well okay lets say I am a damn good programmer and modeler but i want to make an MMO, well forget about it, just get Hero Engine for free or Cry Engine Indie license for free already equiped for MMO’s. Why pay 1500 for something better that is free yet harder to use but if your good enough no worries.

I want to make a beastly game yet don’t have any coding experience but love pro so i buy it. End up making a small game and I get small to little revenue if any from it. bam I just wasted $1500.

Okay I am an indie developer with little cash, I managed to get $1500 saved up and bought pro, well i also got 25 men on my team, damn you cannot work with other developers using Pro too oh nooooooo!!! Well now your negative $1500 unless you find other pro users.

Wait!!!, I can use pro with them but all programming and modeling insertion will all go to me so i can build everything, yey I am over loaded with work.

Maybe i can go to Unity and ask for a developer license for my team, hm, they said it will still cost $1500 each, ouch!!! My wallet hurts.

Summed up pro is over priced for indie developers plain and simple. Most of them may never gain from the investment and have to continue to pay over the years on version upgrades like 4.0x, 5.0x, etc.

A small few may make it but its a lot of money to spend on something with no guarantee and with this crashing economy.

Unity’s prices are not balanced with today’s market. Economy is low so should their prices be too. even a possible discount here and there would be amazing to see.

3.5 expected to be so awesome, yet this rally is only awesome for those with a spare $1500 or an already purchased license.

Most games made are Mobile or small 2d rpg, and way too many FPS. I have yet to see and Indie company make something amazing to even say Torque or any other engine is out of any comparison is rubbish. if you can do the above, buy pro, buy the add ons, find a large team, make an MMO, or large single player, and generate large revenue or at least funding, then you cannot 1UP on any other engine.

I own all Torque licenses and owned them since TGE, even got T3D Pro when it was pricey, same goes for iT2D which cost me 500, so I'm aware what it offers and I still won't change my points exactly due to this. I know what they do and what they don't and in which cases you are getting away much better with unity. when I have to invest 2 weeks to hack out stuff thats standing in the way to make it work like unity does from minute 0 on, Unity even with a pro upgrade wins by definition as 2 weeks >> 1500 one time. And thats with me understanding torque, someone new to torque will need 2 months for it cause you need weeks to understand the engine well enough to go in and change cause its no general purpose engine large parts of its code are and always were tied to FPS, torque after all is the new name of the V12 engine which was developed for Tribes, not as general purpose engine like Unity.

Also ‘they do Mac’ is of no use. As mentioned, no advanced lighting only basic which is at best on the level TGEA was already. Would be as if unity on osx just disabled half its features or better as unity is a osx engine in its roots, it would be the same as if post fx and custom cg were disabled on Windows!
Thats not gonna change anytime soon for T3D as their OSX dev (the same who wrote the Modernization Kit for TGE) left long time ago when they relocated where part of their best programmer staff left actually. He is one of the programmers behind the PushButton Flash engine nowadays unless he switched again.

Also don’t forget: TorqueX does not exist anymore. Yes its still sold but no longer supported or developed, its sold cause the license is required for TorqueX CommunityEdition and it would have hurt that side considerably without it.

The only technologies available and with a future are Torque3D, Torque2D and iTorque2D
They are all great technologies, iT2D made a large step forward with 1.5, but they are in no way in a competition with unity, they don’t play in and for the same field. Unity attracts artists which with torque are in a mine field they can only lose (exception is T2D where you can work purely in script but iT2D and T3D will definitely not let you get away with pure scripting)

Read my update to my post before this one.

I believe you are Dreamora from Realm Crafter am I not mistaken?

@Eclision

It’s quite plain to me that you know next to zero about making full, competent games. I don’t mean this in an offensive way, its just blatantly obvious by your comments.

Your arguments are well thought out but they don’t really strike home unless you are intending on actually seeing a project through. Now I have torque - paid for it - and the engine design is “fucking horrible”, the cross platform support is non existent, and the documentation would simply make wordsworth turn in his grave.

There is nothing remotely good about developing in torque, never has been. It’s just a derived mess from the Tribes engine given to the masses and has not even 10% of unity’s well thought out planned development environment, sorry.

It’s worth about $100, yeah.

I own a Torque3D license and the features missing in it would take me longer to implement than the amount I would pay for a Unity license.

The other engines you listed – CryEngine, HeroEngine, etc all come with royalty models on top of a flat fee.

I agree that the $100 / year for the student pro is definitely fine.
Better than paying a flat $1500 and saying that you wouldn’t is blurp, cause Adobe WEb Premium Student costs $500, when I got mine (CS3) the Educ cost me nearly $1300 …

+1

i have all the Torque licenses too, actually a studio license for each. I also have a Hero Engine license with 99 seats. flat fee? hero has no fees just a 30% royalty unless you can afford royalty free version which is roughly 20k+.

you lost a 0 there, cause HE even single continent costs $200k already, global distribution costs over $700k actually

Eclision: If you hate Unity’s price than why go on the forums?

So you have the version where in the EULA it states they can revoke your access at any time for any reason?

Definitely a platform I’d want to invest my time in!

You keep assuming that person’s time isn’t worth anything. Sure, you may get the full source with a TGE license and a “competent programmer” could do wonders with it… but a competent programmer gets paid $50k right out of college. Even if it takes just two weeks to get Torque3D up to par with Unity, YOU ALREADY AT A LOSS.

Because I hate a price I should not use forums, that’s very funny to say, so since I hate some food prices I should quit eating?

BTW Dreamora you should consider getting some better information on your hero Engine prices I’m afraid.

@andorov, you saying a good programmer get 50k/year out of college, well that’s funny as many are stuck doing mere freelancing at best to build up a portfolio to get hired. Most even work for free to build a game in hopes of future success.

Honestly, I can only speak from my personal experience but I know just one qualified (ie: degree and/or 3+ industry experience) engineer out of work. And I know lots of engineers. The unemployment rate for those with a college degree (and this includes many degrees that I think are completely silly) is only 4.2% (http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.t04.htm)