Hello Everyone,
I’ve released a couple fo multiplayer games now, and I am starting to ferment the idea for the next one. I want to get bigger each time, so I’m not aiming for massive… more like large. I was thinking of doing something that is a sci-fi FPS… and not a space marines with guns game… something different… but anyway…
I noticed most “MMO/RPG” games seem to be third person views.
Why do you think there are more third person MMO games? Is it because everyone is copying each other? Is it because it’s easier to look at a third person view for extended hours vs first person? Is it that if you are “role playing” you want to see your character more?
I’m no expert, but based on my readings and experience, here are some thoughts:
Third person view increases immersion for many people.
Third person view is considered the “standard” for MMOs because that’s how they’re done. (I’ve played a MMO that had only 1st person view. There were frequent questions from new players on how to get third person and then why it wasn’t available.)
First person view only seems to be associated with shooters as that’s how they’re normally done.
Third person where you can choose to zoom into first person gives people the most flexibility in how they want to play.
First person games can induce nausea in some people. Switching to third person often helps mitigate or remove that issue.
From a technical standpoint, third person lets you pan around and see more of the world and your character in that world; that is a lot of rendering. First person, on the other hand, is good for limiting how much is on the screen at any given time and that can help your graphics load.
Given that MMOs are ALL about acquiring sexy/shiny costume/weapons/mounts, you should realize that eliminating 3rd person view from MMOs basically kills MMOs.
The reason MMOs use 3rd person by default (most can zoom in to first person, if you’d like) is because the players spend a lot of time creating their character, getting the cool gear, etc. They want to be able to see them.
Personally, I prefer third person over first in most everything. First person view works well for shooters, but then, I’ve also played some very cool third person shooters (Gears of War).
Do it like skyrim so u can switch . Personally I like 3 rd person so I can see enemies more easily and see how awesome my guy looks butt for like duels 1st person alls the way
I prefer first person for the immersion, but third is good as well. I always liked URU because you could switch at will, allowing you to observe details but also zoom out and see things more broadly, which is helpful a lot of times.
3rd person view is, uhm, PSYCHOLOGICALLY weird. It’s like,me, but not me at the same time. I think it is a lousy way to immerse in to any game that aspires to some sort of realism. It’s fine in Nintendo-World.
In my opinion 3rd person is quite a relaxed camera angel. And I also feel that MMORPG’s are quite relaxed games, which is why people can happily spend 8+hours a day on them. First person is fine for a single player game like skyrim where you go on, steam out some storyline for a few hours then go off, It is also great for showing of the detailed scenery which skyrim is quite respected for. It gets you up close with the enemies and such.
Now lets say the MMORPG were talking about is World of Warcraft, as an Ex WoW player I have to say the perspective was great, its nice to just sit there, and quite casually do what you are doing, there is no stress put on to do things and generally the colour scheme keeps it fun to look at Its nice to have an ‘overview’ of what you’re playing.
This, exactly, the word ‘immersed’ is quite cliche. For example watching films, you are not in first person but you are still immersed.
if anything I find games like WoW and such more immersive than skyrim, I find myself quickly loosing interest when playing it due to the fact I actually have to be ‘immersed’ so much. I have to be paying attention all the time, and its tiring.
I get very immersed in my apps as well, cant put into words how many hours i spent on Cut the Rope and Tiny Tower. I must be clocking 100+ hours already on Simpsons: tapped out.
My point is, we should take a step back, and clarify the word ‘Immersed’. Ill get googles help:
immerse - devote (oneself) fully to; “He immersed himself into his studies”
‘Involved in. If you’re immersed in a book, you’re really into it.’
state of being deeply engaged or involved
So basically it seems like people take the term far to literally and act like its more than it is, you could say there are different ‘stages’ of being immersed, like a 1-10 counter. But I think people need to take it lightly, you can get immersed in anything, it all depends on your personal preference.
I think immersion is really just a matter of emotional investment. No game (currently) will ever make you feel like you are “actually there”. That’s just silly. But, if you actually begin to care about the characters and the people, you are immersed. This can be done with any camera perspective.
I think the most immersed I’ve ever been in a game was Final Fantasy 7. That was a direct result of the world and the emotional characters and events.
I don’t like first person, it makes me kind of feel constrained like I can’t see behind me, and it is just annoying because to look behind me I have to move the joystick for to long, until VR is good first person will always be bad IMO.
In my opinion third person is much more better for most games because a player is easily able to observe the world around him. In a first person view i feel as though I am locked and restricted. I dont know about everyone else, but i feel kind of uncomfortable in first person views, so i avoid first person shooters.
I guess there is also technical reason behind this choice.
In MMOs you can usually aim at everything at the screen when in 1 Person you can only see and shoot what’s in front.
Then you can more easily render the world from a top point of view
The interface (which is an important aspect of the MMO worlds) is used with a mouse. How can you decide if you are moving your head or just trying to reach the interface ?
Immersion is not about the game perfectly mimicking the laws of real life (in this case, the law that you cannot see yourself) so that the player forgets they are playing a game. Immersion is about making the player so absorbed in the unique rules about the game world that they temporarily stop paying attention to real life. Minecraft is one of the most immersive games I’ve played, yet it has hundreds of odd quirks that are nowhere to be found in real life - when I’m immersed, the laws of the game become reality. In fact, the unrealisticness of Minecraft makes it even more immersive: because the game makes no attempt to conform to reality, I don’t think twice about swimming up a waterfall. It’s normal in the context of the game.
So the first-person for immersion argument is nil - you can have immersion with any camera angle.
As a past ArmA 2 player using a Track IR Pro head tracker, it took my gaming to another level entirely. It added that ability to quickly check over your shoulder to see if the enemy was sneaking up on your 6 (which saved my ass plenty of times*), likewise for the helos and jets; I had withdrawals when I couldn’t use it for other fps games.
I’m excited to see the Oculus Rift emerging to advance the experience. You’ll never be the same.
Gameplay also heavily dictates the camera view in most MMORPG’s - you need to be aware of your surroundings while facing the same direction for a prolonged period of time, which isn’t possible with a first person view. That’s not to say you couldn’t make a first person MMORPG, only that the gameplay would have to differ in significant ways for it to be possible - which for such an insanely expensive genre to create in is entirely too experimental.
You’re losing a ton to gain first person view for the genre; if you want to make a first person massively multiplayer game you would need to approach it from the other direction. What makes first person gameplay compelling? How can we translate that to an experience that feels like you’re cooperating with with large groups of other players, and not just working on objectives near large groups of other players? It would be very easy to fall into the trap where organized group play feels like a truly deep multiplayer experience, but casual large group play feels like working on single player objectives near one another.
For what it’s worth, I can’t think of a modern MMO that doesn’t allow you to enter first person view - you just keep zooming in until you’re in first person mode. It’s just so sub-optimal from a gameplay standpoint nobody uses it for anything other than taking screen shots without their character model in the way.
Its nice to have an ‘overview’ of what you’re playing.