Why games like MOBA (LoL, Dota2 and etc) using Strength, Agility, and Intelligence?
At the end, they are used to determine the Max HP, Max Mana, Attack Speed and etc. Why not only using Max HP, Max Mana, Attack Speed?
Thanks
Because that’s how Dungeons and Dragons did it*. And pretty much every RPG game since has worked on the same system. There is a lot to be said for using existing systems and not forcing the player to take on the cognitive load of learning new mechanics.
In practice having a layer between the stats the player can choose and the in game stats allows the devs more space to tweak and balance the systems. Often multiple stats give a hit point bonus. Stats can also combine in odd ways. And so on.
*Dungeons and Dragon’s probably copied it from somewhere else. But I’m not that old to remember.
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Because three base values are far more easy to evaluate at a glance than the dozens of derived stats based on them. Also, these abstract concepts are easier to grasp for someone not familiar with the game mechanics, because everybody knows what strength is, but derived stats can often become really arcane.
Also, it’s not like DotA2 hides the derived stats from the player, it just has a clear distinction between the stuff you want to look at first and the less important details. Tiered display of information is important. Look at any good infographic with lots of information on it, and it will always have some information that’s clearly highlighted because it’s more important than the nitty-gritty.
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Because they usually do more than one thing ( intelligence → more mana and more spell damage ), so your proposed alternative terms would be half truths.
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Im also thinking about it, it like layer in programming. but could you please give an more spesific example, or maybe an article for it?
What do you think about dota2 case, now it has many item that change stats directly (+mana, +damage, +movementspeed, +attackspeed, +critical, +attackrange) not from Strength, Agility and Intiliggence.
And also i often dont care about Strength, Agility and Intiliggence when playing it.
One thing to think about is that those sorts of stats are humanizing. You can comprehend a character easier if you have stats that correlate to real world notions, and not purely to game logic.
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DotA uses base stats where appropriate, and derived stats otherwise. Simple as that.
So do what you want. It’s your game. If you think your idea is better, step up and do it. Games have rules the designer chooses for them.
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Lol uses stats straight as HP, Mana or Magic damage and I like it, want faster attacks, buy item with attack speed. Nice and easy.
Yes, i agree about it. But I need other opinion to ensure what i’m thinking because i don’t have much experience.
This is the summary:
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Using existing systems and not forcing the player to take on the cognitive load of learning new mechanics.
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Tiered display of information is important
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Having a layer between the stats the player can choose and the in game stats allows the devs more space to tweak and balance the system
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Because they usually do more than one thing ( intelligence → more mana and more spell damage ), so your proposed alternative terms.
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Humanizing so we can comprehend a character easier if you have stats that correlate to real world notions, and not purely to game logic
is that all?
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Its because DOTA originated in warcraft3 and those were the stats you had to work with
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Its interesting to then ask why Warcraft 3 had those particular three attributes. D&D and most other RPGs tend to run higher, with anywhere from six to ten attributes.
In Warcraft the player was managing tonnes of other Units, as well as several heroes. Keeping the attributes down to a bare minimum helped with the number of things a player had to think about. The three attributes represented the three main types of hero. Strength was good for close range melee combat. Agility indicated a ranged fighter. Intelligence indicated a support character.
When this moved across to MOBA the attributes stuck. But its also important to note that their are significant differences between a MOBA and an RPG. A MOBA match typically lasts between half an hour to two hours. An RPG might take 30-40 hours or even longer. So in a single MOBA match the player has less time to fine tune dozens of attributes. Keeping the system simple is beneficial.
In dota theres over 100 different characters, with hundreds of items, each character has 4 spells and then you have to actually adjust what character you play, how you play it (choosing your items and order you get your spells) based on the enemy team picks, Im not really sure how much more complex you’d want to make it.
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Because simply using Max HP doesn’t tell you anything other than Max HP. If you want to have multiple different variables to affect your game, simply using Max HP doesn’t work, or shouldn’t at least. MOBAs have a lot more systems running than Max HP = this, damage = this, new health = this. There’s just a whole lot more to it than that.
We were working on a MOBA but eventually decided it was in our best interest to put it aside. Before that however, we determined that showing the values instead of the stats was much better. Damage, Health, Speed, Resource Recovery, etc. If you wanted a higher value you’d buy/earn it directly. +5 damage, +25 health, +1 speed, +.2 Resource Recovery.
It was really nice because you didn’t have to try to process on the fly if what you were upgrading to was worth it. I really am tired of abstracted stats.
Smite does exactly what you’re saying.
And I think it works great!